Vaccinations: Do or Don't

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Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #330 on: November 17, 2008, 12:40:48 PM » by 4myhoonie

Quote from: LKS on November 17, 2008, 12:36:29 PM

I just received a "flyer" from our ins. company 'reminding' me that our 2 yr old was 'behind' on his vaccinations. Shocked

A) how do they know? B) Why do they care? Kind of made me wonder....

weird! none of their business! i imagine it's something to do with the expense of dr. visits for whooping cough or whatever being more expensive than the vax. crazy, but it's all about money. Embarrassed

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Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #331 on: November 17, 2008, 12:42:43 PM » by LKS

Well aside from it being none of their business, my husband & I were kind of blown away because they never want to pay for ANYTHING. We have to fight for every claim & here they are WANTING us to go to the DR? Huh

? Too weird.

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Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #332 on: December 05, 2008, 01:06:32 PM » by JuliaofSunnyside

Get this:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,462405,00.html

Can you believe what the coroner called it?

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Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #333 on: December 05, 2008, 01:21:03 PM » by herbs girl

That is soo scary. I dont know if I want to vaccinate my baby now!

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Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #334 on: December 05, 2008, 01:31:39 PM » by larissakissa

Quote from: JuliaofSunnyside on December 05, 2008, 01:06:32 PM

Get this:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,462405,00.html

Can you believe what the coroner called it?

This makes me sooo MAD! Angry

I can't believe they wouldn't acknowledge that it WAS the vaccine that caused the death. They should have known not to give ANY vaccines if a child is sick with ANYTHING, especially with a fever. In Russia, when I was little, nobody could vaccinate a child if he was sick, even with just a little cough. They always made the parents come back in a week or two, just to be on the safe side. Personally, I don't vaccinate any of my children, and I'm telling everyone I know not to either.
I feel so bad for the parents of the little boy. Cry

I hope they can find peace, and justice for what happened.

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Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #335 on: December 06, 2008, 10:58:37 PM » by larissakissa

I just found this survey that was done in Netherlands in 2004 by an independent association made up of doctors, therapists, and parents. It is about the health of two groups of children, the ones who were fully vaccinated and ones who were non vaccinated. See for your self what the numbers are. You won't belive how much sicker the fully vaccinated children are! Here is a link to the survey:
http://www.thinktwice.com/Dutch.pdf
you will need adobe reader to view it. Pass this on to friends and family who belive in vaccinations. Wink

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Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #336 on: December 07, 2008, 06:58:08 AM » by khix

Quote from: JuliaofSunnyside on December 05, 2008, 01:06:32 PM

Get this:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,462405,00.html

Can you believe what the coroner called it?

Quote

Crickmore believes George died from a rare condition known as sudden unexpected death in childhood, due to an unknown disease.

You're kidding me, right? This is the best he could come up with it? I mean, even a child could see that the above statement is a bunch of hogwash! I actually laughed when I read that sentence!

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Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #337 on: December 07, 2008, 08:58:42 AM » by Mrs. Visionary

Quote from: LKS on November 17, 2008, 12:36:29 PM

I just received a "flyer" from our ins. company 'reminding' me that our 2 yr old was 'behind' on his vaccinations. Shocked

A) how do they know? B) Why do they care? Kind of made me wonder....

I believe this has to do with the fact that the government which is in bed with the pharmaceutical companies have their tentacles just about everywhere they can get them to monitor and enforce compliance with immunization schedules. My mom used to have a daycare in California and the local government there started wanting her to keep track of whether the kids in her care were up to date on their shots. It would be no problem for insurance companies to reverse engineer the information by tallying up absence of claims coming in for immunizations on members.

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Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #338 on: December 07, 2008, 08:53:59 PM » by hi_itsgwen

I have also recieved a letter from my insurance company, as well as an automated phone call in which I was supposed to respond in the affirmative that I understood their directive to ~~asissinate~~ vaccinate my child.

I did vaccinate my first two, but I am being so much more careful now after my son got mumps after his MMR, and the Doctor told me that it was 'unrelated' to his vaccine. Yeah, right.

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Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #339 on: December 07, 2008, 08:59:04 PM » by JuliaofSunnyside

Quote from: khix on December 07, 2008, 06:58:08 AM

Quote from: JuliaofSunnyside on December 05, 2008, 01:06:32 PM

Get this:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,462405,00.html

Can you believe what the coroner called it?

Quote

Crickmore believes George died from a rare condition known as sudden unexpected death in childhood, due to an unknown disease.

You're kidding me, right? This is the best he could come up with it? I mean, even a child could see that the above statement is a bunch of hogwash! I actually laughed when I read that sentence!

Isn't that weird that the coroner could actually call it that and seem credible enough to quote on the news? Especially when the parents have a lot better explanation?

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Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #340 on: December 08, 2008, 08:26:45 AM » by khix

Quote from: JuliaofSunnyside on December 07, 2008, 08:59:04 PM

Quote from: khix on December 07, 2008, 06:58:08 AM

Quote from: JuliaofSunnyside on December 05, 2008, 01:06:32 PM

Get this:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,462405,00.html

Can you believe what the coroner called it?

Quote

Crickmore believes George died from a rare condition known as sudden unexpected death in childhood, due to an unknown disease.

You're kidding me, right? This is the best he could come up with it? I mean, even a child could see that the above statement is a bunch of hogwash! I actually laughed when I read that sentence!

Isn't that weird that the coroner could actually call it that and seem credible enough to quote on the news? Especially when the parents have a lot better explanation?

So, if I don't know how someone died, I guess that means I'm qualified to be a coroner! Someone get me a job application! Tongue

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Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #341 on: December 30, 2008, 12:35:59 PM » by natural

Hi all
My sister has a baby who had his first round of shots..he is soon to go in for his 4 month check up and she doesn't want to give him all the shots, but her dh isn't convinced she should withdraw all the shots...which ones should she give her baby (least harmful)?

I know I read someone's opinion here, but can't find it. It said there were a few NOT to give and a couple that were less dangerous.

Any opinions??

PS Just to clarify, I don't vaccinate my kids, but if I had a dh that MADE me or asked me to compormise which ones would I do? I did read that DTP should be held off till 2 years old...any other OPINIONS?

« Last Edit: December 30, 2008, 01:12:54 PM by natural »
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4 yo Maciah: Mamma I am scared the wind is howling.
Me: Go to sleep Jesus will protect you.
4 yo Maciah: (stretching his chin to chest) But, but I can't see Jesus my head can't reach into my heart.

Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #342 on: December 30, 2008, 02:17:49 PM » by KristenA

Quote from: natural on December 30, 2008, 12:35:59 PM

Tell her to read the book The Vaccine Book by Dr. Robert Sears.
It has an alternative vaccine schedule along with ingredients of all the shots and brands,,.... and which ones (he considers) are the most imporatant. It's super easy to read.

But most alternative health practitioners are aren't ANTI vaccines, but FOR safe vaccines recommend after age 2 to do some of the most important shots (diptheria, tetanus, polio, and sometimes pertussis).

HTH

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Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #343 on: December 30, 2008, 02:37:32 PM » by natural

thanks for this, I did tell her to go to the lib to check that book out. I appreciate your input!! thank you thank you!!!

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4 yo Maciah: Mamma I am scared the wind is howling.
Me: Go to sleep Jesus will protect you.
4 yo Maciah: (stretching his chin to chest) But, but I can't see Jesus my head can't reach into my heart.

Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #344 on: December 30, 2008, 03:07:55 PM » by JuliaofSunnyside

Quote from: KristenA on December 30, 2008, 02:17:49 PM

Quote from: natural on December 30, 2008, 12:35:59 PM

KristenA, do you have that schedule? Is there any way to post it? I couldn't find it on his site. Maybe the book is at the library.

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Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #345 on: December 30, 2008, 05:53:54 PM » by KristenA

Quote from: JuliaofSunnyside on December 30, 2008, 03:07:55 PM

Quote from: KristenA on December 30, 2008, 02:17:49 PM

Quote from: natural on December 30, 2008, 12:35:59 PM

KristenA, do you have that schedule? Is there any way to post it? I couldn't find it on his site. Maybe the book is at the library.

I don't know where to find except in the book.
He's all about choosing the brand with the least aluminum and other bad ingredients.... and spacing out shots and waiting on some shots.

Oh wait, he has an Alernative Schedule & A Conservative Schedule (even less)

On his conservative schedule he did NOT have: IPV, MMR, chicken pox
But his alternative schedule had almost all the vaccines... just spaced/age differently.

He was definitely trained by the AMA... but his book is a good reference when choosing a certain brand's vaccine and how the vaccine came into existence.

Natural, maybe suggest to your friend not to be "no vaccines" just to stall or research more. Maybe they can learn together and decide then.
Oh! Here's another good site for them: www.generationrescue.org

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Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #346 on: December 30, 2008, 05:55:42 PM » by KristenA

Oh! and my old pediatrician advises his patients to NEVER give the MMR before age 2 1/2.... and to give the shots separately (Measles vaccine, Mumps Vaccine, Rubella Vaccine) when desired.

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Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #347 on: December 30, 2008, 09:55:04 PM » by healthybratt

Quote from: natural on December 30, 2008, 12:35:59 PM

MMR has been linked to autism. I would probably avoid this one altogether if I had it to do all over again with my kids.

I would also probably avoid prevnar, hib, chicken pox, and hep B. Also the new one for HPV (not sure what age they recommend this, but I wouldn't give it to an adult much less an infant.)

« Last Edit: December 30, 2008, 09:57:25 PM by healthybratt »
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Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #348 on: December 31, 2008, 01:25:35 PM » by natural

The Vaccine Book by Dr. Robert Sears...do you know how up to date this book is?
Last yr my dr said that there were few of the vaccines that still had thimerisol in them...but then we looked on the packages and it didn't actually say, which I thought was strange that it didnt give the ingredients on it...So I opted out =)

Dr Mercola makes a good pt too when he says that mercury isn't the only bad thing in vaccines, there are other preservatives, etc that are not good.

I appreciate all you input so far, thanks!!!

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4 yo Maciah: Mamma I am scared the wind is howling.
Me: Go to sleep Jesus will protect you.
4 yo Maciah: (stretching his chin to chest) But, but I can't see Jesus my head can't reach into my heart.

Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #349 on: December 31, 2008, 01:33:18 PM » by KristenA

Quote from: natural on December 31, 2008, 01:25:35 PM

The Vaccine Book by Dr. Robert Sears...do you know how up to date this book is?

I read it last year and it was very up to date for me.... Had all the current vaccines.

And yes, congress outlawed thimerasol in childhood vaccines (a few years back).... But there are people out there that say it isn't all out. I have no idea......

I know for sure the flu shot has mercury.

I believe Dr. Sears goes on the assumption/fact?? that there is no thimerasol in vaccines.

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Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #350 on: December 31, 2008, 05:54:48 PM » by natural

Interesting! wonder whose right?

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4 yo Maciah: Mamma I am scared the wind is howling.
Me: Go to sleep Jesus will protect you.
4 yo Maciah: (stretching his chin to chest) But, but I can't see Jesus my head can't reach into my heart.

Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #351 on: December 31, 2008, 06:19:02 PM » by stebs7

I read awhile back that they could no longer put thimerosol in vaccinations but they were able to use up the ones that had already been produced with thimerosol in it. So maybe they had a huge stock of them before the law came into being? Huh

I agree with Mercola - mercury wasn't the only thing bad with vaccinations. The epidemia of children with juvenile diabetes, allergies, asthma, autism,etc. - things that rarely happened before the time when either there were no vaccinations or fewer vaccinations - shows that there are plenty of ingredients that are causing the body to dysfunction.

I know quite a few families that do not vaccinate (at all) (including ours) - whose children are very healthy - not seeing the doctor for years = or ever - that have never had antibiotics - haven't had an ear infection, bronchitis, eczema - ever. One family vaccinated their first 2 children - not the 3rd - he is over a year and never sick. She is on a forum with mothers of children born the same day/week as hers - they all complain about all the sicknesses their babies have - they are so surprised - because their first 2 children were the same - sick often.

In our case, we know through prayer that we were not to vaccinate (this was after we had vaccinated our first for almost 2 years but never had a peace about it until we finally prayed about it and knew that we were not to vaccinate. Later, we found out that our second child was developmentally delayed and had epilepsy. When he was 4 yrs old, a doctor told us it was good we never vaccinated him or he could have been much worse off. That was a confirmation to us. (As an aside, we have never given him medication for epilepsy - just a natural diet (not strict) and glyconutrients. he has not had an attack in over 5 years).

Blessings, Nancy in Poland

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Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #352 on: December 31, 2008, 07:13:14 PM » by denim&lace

Talk to me about the Perussis shot.

I had discussed vacinations with our regular doctor and he was very OK with whatever we had decided, though he did warn me that we get an abundance of whooping cough up here and to be careful of anybody with 'cold symptoms or a cough'.

I recently went to the pediatrician (stand in for our usual doctor) with my 1 yo and through the course of conversation told her that I am expecting again in August. She said that we may very well want to go ahead and have the 1 yo vacinated against pertussis so she didn't bring it home to the baby, with her toddling about touching everything in every grocery store, library, etc that we visit... That was the only vaccine that she said anything about.

So what do you know about the DTP shot? Can you get JUST the pertussis shot alone? Have any of your children had a negative reaction to the DTP or Pertussis shot?

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Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #353 on: December 31, 2008, 07:16:41 PM » by Kitty

I haven't read the whole thread but wondered if anyone had shared the perspective by Dr. Natasha Campbell-McBride of the GAPS program? I've been reading her book and found her philosophy on vaccinations unique in that she would recommend a health history be taken to assess a child's health BEFORE immunizing--looking at gut health, use of antibiotics, etc. If a child was considered "healthy" in this regard, I think she suggested doing single vaccines around age 5...i.e., not measles, mumps and rubella all at once.

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Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #354 on: December 31, 2008, 08:56:24 PM » by KristenA

Quote from: denim&lace on December 31, 2008, 07:13:14 PM

So what do you know about the DTP shot? Can you get JUST the pertussis shot alone? Have any of your children had a negative reaction to the DTP or Pertussis shot?

Nope. You can't get just the Pertussis. The reason is bc the pertussis aspect of the DTaP is the most virulent (with negative side effects). It's now acellular Pertusis (versus the old one). Back in the 80s or 90s there was a lot of bad press for the DTP (SIDS)...... so they changed it to the DTaP.

I read on one pharmaceutical site (I wish I could remember where) that they give the DT (just diphtheria and tetanus) for kids 7 and older because(something like this):
For people older than 7 the side effects of the disease Pertussis are less dangerous than the side effects of the vaccine. However, for younger children... the side effects/damage of Pertussis are greater than the risk of the vaccination.

I've also read that Pertussis (whooping cough) is caught OFTEN when fully vaccinated... However, symptoms are less severe.

Pertussis scares me BAD for kids younger than 1 yr old. DTaP vaccine doesn't scare me so bad for kids older than age 2.
IMO Diptheria and Tetanus are good diseases to keep a bay in a population. I just wish the Pertussis aspect of the vaccine worked as well as the D & the T.

It's a tough one Denim.

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Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #355 on: January 01, 2009, 09:54:54 PM » by denim&lace

Taken from the CDC website:

Quote

What are the risks from DTaP vaccine?
Getting diphtheria, tetanus or pertussis disease is much riskier than getting DTaP vaccine.

However, a vaccine, like any medicine, is capable of causing serious problems, such as severe allergic reactions. The risk of DTaP vaccine causing serious harm, or death, is extremely small.

Mild Problems (Common)

Fever (up to about 1 child in 4)
Redness or swelling where the shot was given (up to about 1 child in 4)
Soreness or tenderness where the shot was given (up to about 1 child in 4)
These problems occur more often after the 4th and 5th doses of the DTaP series than after earlier doses.

Sometimes the 4th or 5th dose of DTaP vaccine is followed by swelling of the entire arm or leg in which the shot was given, for 1 to 7 days (up to about 1 child in 30).

Other mild problems include:

Fussiness (up to about 1 child in 3)
Tiredness or poor appetite (up to about 1 child in 10)
Vomiting (up to about 1 child in 50)
These problems generally occur 1 to 3 days after the shot.

Moderate Problems (Uncommon)

Seizure (jerking or staring) (about 1 child out of 14,000)
Non-stop crying, for 3 hours or more (up to about 1 child out of 1,000)
High fever, 105 degrees Fahrenheit or higher (about 1 child out of 16,000)
Severe Problems (Very Rare)
Serious allergic reaction (less than 1 out of a million doses) Several other severe problems have been reported after DTaP vaccine. These include:

Long-term seizures, coma, or lowered consciousness
Permanent brain damage.
These are so rare it is hard to tell if they are caused by the vaccine.

Controlling fever is especially important for children who have had seizures, for any reason. It is also important if another family member has had seizures.

You can reduce fever and pain by giving your child an aspirin-free pain reliever when the shot is given, and for the next 24 hours, following the package instructions.

Hmmmmm... Alaska has one of the highest rates of pertussis... which explains why the pediatritian brought it up... We also have one of the lowest vacination rates.

My husband and I are still disucussing it... thank you for the info Kristen!

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Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #356 on: January 01, 2009, 10:23:03 PM » by Ruby

I read that Merck is going to stop making separate vaccines for MMR and just make the combined one. Does anyone know if there are other companies who make them separately?

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Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #357 on: January 02, 2009, 04:31:18 PM » by stebs7

There was a high school in Arkansas where about 1,000 children had whooping cough (pertussis) - over 90% had been vaccinated - at the same time in Holland there was 1000 kids with whooping cough. Here in Poland there was a big epidemia of it - but they didn't know what it was for a long time because they hadnt seen it in many years. They say that the disease has mutated so that the vaccine no longer works on it.

I have read that whooping cough is not dangerous for babies that have been breastfed. In fact, years ago, I heard about a director of a major hospital that had $100 in his drawer - for any doctor that could show him a totally breast fed baby that had any of the illnesses that we vaccinate for - at that time (I haven't kept up with it) the $100 had been waiting for quite a few years with no callers.

They say the symptoms are milder for those that have been vaccinated - but they may also get it several times - they have not built up immunity against it - whereas children who have not been vaccinated have it once and have immunity for life.

Four of our children had whooping cough at the same time - they youngest must have been about 3 - it was a bit tiring staying up to hold the bowl under them - but I remember it as a very special time

because the kids were at home for over a month from school (that's when they attended school) and we just loved being together. That gave me the greatest desire to homeschool (at that time I thought it was illegal here because that is what I had been told) - and later we were able to homeschool.

There was an old doctor in Scotland that researched whooping cough - with those in the countries and cities of Scotland. He said that he thought we are supposed to go through whooping cough as children - that it helps us to build up our immunity system at an early age which makes us healthier in old age. (this is when I spent hours and hours researching whooping cough at the beginning - I was even in touch with a doctor in England who knew more about whooping cough then anyone else supposedly in the world - I told him about the epidemia in Arkansas and he was shocked that someone knew something about whooping cough that he didnt

I have heard from quite a few older people here in Poland who said that everyone went through whooping cough when they were young - she remembers it very well and it was something that was normal.

In China, whooping cough is called the 100 day cough. I always wonder why children all over the world have the same childhood diseases - if we aren't supposed to go through them. I don't think its just because of the fall - or bacterias in the air. The children with strong immunity systems seemed to go through the diseases well. So maybe our object is to be sure we are breastfeeding, feeding our children well - not vaccinating (to be sure our children will be healthier

- my opinion is that children who have not been vaccinated are healthier than those who are vaccinated as a whole)-

I remember talking with one of the leaders in the Homeschool movement in America where there are many families that do not vaccinate. He told me that one of the homeschool leaders that he had much respect for - said it this way - that God said only the sick need a doctor - and we take our healthy babies in to be vaccinated? Huh

I think the main thing is to read up about them - and pray - God showed us very clearly that we were not to vaccinate - I kept having such a lack of peace in my spirit when I went with our first son to vaccinate - then when we had our second child and they mentioned vaccinations - again that lack came back and we said okay , Lord, if you are trying to warn us about something - we will research this subject. The more we read, the more we realized why I didn't have that peace. My husband confirmed that the Lord was showing us not to vaccinate.

Sorry for writing a book - I used to not talk about vaccinations - but later felt like God was asking me to share bout it - but especially here I tell people they need to pray for themselves - but also when you don't vaccinate - you need to build up your child's immune system. That's where healthy eating and natural home remedies come into place. Master Tonic, Bee Pollen, Vit C, Propolis etc etc.

In England, children are rarely given antibiotics - doctors tell the parents to give the child a tylenol for instance and wait for a week. A friend who works in a hospital there says the hospitals are full - of old people! That there are not many middle age people or children in the hospitals (of course you may have wards for those with cancer, etc but generally hospitals there are for old people - interesting! You see older people in England everywhere - they volunteer in post offices at 70 years old - walk everywhere, are on all the buses! They are very respected also. Alot of people in England question vaccinations - its in the newspapers alot. That's where Dr. Andrew Wakefield researched vaccinations involvement in Autism.

You would think this is a result of drinking coffee (my writing on and on) but actually its a subject that I am very interested in (and I don't drink coffee!).

Blessings from Poland, Nancy

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Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #358 on: January 02, 2009, 04:43:30 PM » by denim&lace

Wow! Thank you Nancy.

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"Thus it now appears to me that trust, and not submission, defines obedience." ~ Joan W. Blos in 'A Gathering of Days'

Re: Vaccinations: Do or Don't
« Reply #359 on: January 09, 2009, 11:41:37 AM » by 1ofeach

I'm going to post this on several threads, inlcuding internet sales and a few on vaccines. I hope that's ok, HB!

Tropical Traditions has Saying NO to Vaccines on sale, for 40% off, until Sunday 1/11/09.

Click here: Saying NO to Vaccines book and dvd combo $39 till 1/11/09

Just FYI!

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