Progesterone Cream: How, Why & When to Use

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Re: Progesterone Cream: How, Why & When to Use
« Reply #120 on: September 19, 2009, 10:00:28 PM » by mommie

Patti...interesting. The pharmicist I'm working with has me on it days 7 - 28 (but specifically said he didn't want to get rid of my period!) would I be doing that or suppressing ovulation by being on it that long?

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Re: Progesterone Cream: How, Why & When to Use
« Reply #121 on: November 19, 2009, 12:38:42 PM » by McAfeeFam

I have been using beeyoutiful's natural progesterone cream for 2 months now. I am 32 yrs old and have had a ton of estrogen dominance symptoms over the years. During the pregnancies of my 5 children I had spotting at the beginning and preterm labor at the end and weight gain ranged from 1lb - 15lbs at the highest. Afterwards while nursing I would gain almost 30lbs without doing anything different. Which I was unable to lose till the next pregnancy so it has compounded and I still weigh what I did at 9 months pregnant with my son who is 14mo old

My periods usually started within 6mo and have gradually gotten heavier and heaver and are now 40-45 days between.
I started progesterone on day 10-15 (I forget the exact day) and took it till I started at day 42 then stopped till day 10 because I felt stressed to the max.

I started this time at day 16 and had a full 5 day period that started very suddenly and was still pretty heavy and lots of clots. I was going to wait till day 15 to start back up again but the last couple days I have had no patience whatsoever, gained weight and feel very PMSie. I don't know if I can wait another 5 days or not. What should I do!!??

I have not been tested so yes I am doing the dreaded self diagnosis. We live in a tiny town in AZ hundreds of miles from a NA and have not popped the question to my MD yet. I would love to do the online saliva test but this economy has hit us hard and money is stretched as thin as possible.

Any advice?

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Re: Progesterone Cream: How, Why & When to Use
« Reply #122 on: November 19, 2009, 02:05:31 PM » by mykidsmom

Quote from: mommie on September 19, 2009, 10:00:28 PM

I just now saw this. You might not supress ovulation but it will mess up your hormones. You are supposed to be estrogen dominant from days 1-14. On days 15-28 you are supposed to be progesterone dominant in case you get pregnant so your body can hold the baby. I would not suggest you take it starting on day 7. I would recommend you use it on days 15-28 (or whatever the normal length of your cycle is). The idea is to mimic your body's natural cycle; not change it.

hth

patti

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Re: Progesterone Cream: How, Why & When to Use
« Reply #123 on: November 19, 2009, 02:10:38 PM » by mykidsmom

Quote from: McAfeeFam on November 19, 2009, 12:38:42 PM

You're not getting enough progesterone. Unfortunately, until you find out exactly how much you need you will probably still struggle. Your story sounds just like mine though! I gained weight AFTER I had my last baby. That is frustrating!

One thing you need to change right now is how you're using the progesterone that you are taking. Do NOT continue taking it beyond a 30 day cycle. What you are trying to do is put your body back into normal rhythm. So use the cream from days 15-28 or 30 (whatever your NORMAL cycle is) and don't touch it again until you cycle and hit day 15 again. It may take a few months but should put your body back into a more normal rhythm. You will likely continue to bleed heavy until you get enough progesterone into your system on a regular basis. If someone isn't too low doing what you are can work. But when someone is just way too low then OTC's won't work. You need something prescribed to give you exactly what you need.

hth

patti

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Re: Progesterone Cream: How, Why & When to Use
« Reply #124 on: November 19, 2009, 04:37:56 PM » by mommie

well i got a yeast infection that monistat won't kill (guess thats only 1 in 100 of his clients have this prob...) so I'm off all hormones
and B's till i can rid the yeast vaginally and possibly systemically.... Sad

thx for your thoughts patti ... that makes more sense to me...

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Re: Progesterone Cream: How, Why & When to Use
« Reply #125 on: December 31, 2009, 01:51:21 AM » by lilbrick

I am 35 I do not have periods. I have PCOS, have had endometriosis, have adrenal fatigue, my progesterone is low I believe she said that I am estrogen dominant, my D is low and several other imbalances. I take 1000mg metforman a day for the PCOS (have for a few years off and on), 5000mg D3 daily, half gram twice a day (so 1 gram a day) of
c-progesterone 10% cream (doesn't have mg on tube at all), and 1 capsule c-progesterone 100mg SR CAP daily at bedtime. I wasn't told anything about cycle days for the progesterone. I don't have cycles though so that wouldn't work for me anyway. I was told that I would probably only take the progesterone pills for a month or so but I was not told how long I would use the progesterone cream. I have been taking the D3, the progesterone cream and progesterone pills for about a week now and for the last 5 days I have been exhausted. I am tired all the time. Could it be the progesterone? Do you think I am on to much progesterone? Please help.

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Re: Progesterone Cream: How, Why & When to Use
« Reply #126 on: December 31, 2009, 11:13:34 AM » by mykidsmom

Yes. Is this OTC or prescribed? Is it bio-identical? Yes, you can cycle your progesterone correctly even without having periods. This sounds like too much of a mish mash of stuff to be helpful to your body. Why are you using metformin for PCOS if you're not having periods? I'm assuming you're not planning children at this point?

patti

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Re: Progesterone Cream: How, Why & When to Use
« Reply #127 on: December 31, 2009, 11:27:44 AM » by hi_itsgwen

lilbrick, I can't help you with the progesterone cream dosage amounts, but I will link you to these two threads on estrogen dominance. They're a must read for someone experiencing the symptoms that you are. IMO, removing the source of the estrogen flooding would need to be the first line of defense before supplementation.
Xenoestrogens: Chemicals that raise your estrogen levels
Phytoestrogens: Foods, herbs etc. that raise your estrogen levels

It does seem like a *lot* of different things to be taking, IMO.
If your current supplements aren't feeling 'right' I would talk to your doctor about coming off of them, and trying a diet/environment cleanse first to try to re-adjust your estrogen levels (if you feel that this applies to you). Then I would personally look at Vitex next, and then progesterone supplementation after that if your levels are still way off. I've not experience adrenal fatigue, but I'm sure you'd need to be treating and considering that as well.

I can tell you that my sister has had major hormone imbalance issues, and was diagnosed with all different things. She chose to just live with it as opposed to taking meds, and had to take progesterone to jump start a monthly every few months. After we stumbled onto this info above, she cleaned up her diet/environment, and began to have an every two month cycle on her own. Vitex is helping to bring this further into balance (and is not a hormone...it's a berry that stimulates the hormone system to balance itself.) So it's possilble to see major changes just by reducing your hormone exposure.

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Re: Progesterone Cream: How, Why & When to Use
« Reply #128 on: February 09, 2010, 09:38:59 PM » by Kati*did

I am thoroughly confused, consternated and frustrated. Any help I can get would be very appreciated.

I have type 1 diabetes. I also take a an epilepsy med (depakote) that either causes the symptoms of PCOS or the causes the real thing in the body (research hasn't determined which). Anyway, I have some of the symptoms. My period is regular, I don't know if I ovulate. About a year ago, I tried using 20 mg progesterone cream per day from days 15-28 to see if it would help the PCOS symptoms and PMS. It seemed to help the PMS, but overall, I didn't notice a big difference. I was worried that I might be screwing up my hormones, so quit after 3 months.

Although the cramps I'd get with my period were gone after the 3 months, I began getting *extremely* angry and moody around the time when I should ovulate and sometimes right before and/or after my period ended (during my period I'm fine) This has gotten gradually worse and I hate it. I'd rather have horrible cramps. So I decided to try the progesterone again.

I started it again this cycle and have felt more angry and agitated than ever before, zero libido, and my blood sugars are almost impossible to keep in check. I've doubled my insulin and it still seems that my body is resisting it.

So what might be going on? If this is an "adjustment period", I don't think I'll be able to wait for the adjustment with my blood sugar so uncontrollable. Plus, I'm sick of feeling angry at and about everything.

Ideas in my head are:

1. The initial adjustment period where the estrogen receptor sites are opened by the progesterone has me higher than ever on estrogen causing my body to have enormous insulin resistance and anger/moodines and dead libido. Do I need more progesterone?

2. I somehow have too many androgens and that's causing the anger? Could using progesterone cream make this worse? But if I have too many androgens, I'd think I would have some libido.

3. I just don't know.

I'd love any help I can get as I'm probably not going to keep using it for the next cycle if I can't get it figured out. Thanks for any ideas.

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Re: Progesterone Cream: How, Why & When to Use
« Reply #129 on: February 09, 2010, 10:46:51 PM » by mykidsmom

Katie,

Your body has a lot going on. My experience with progesterone and anger is that not enough creates the anger/PMS issues. Are you using OTC cream? Because of your other health issues, and life in general (age, etc), it is very likely you can't get enough progesterone in an OTC. You likely need it prescribed specifically for what you need which means you need to be blood tested and have it prescribed from there.

It's possible that when you used it before your body was just on the cusp of needing it so a smaller mg. worked. As time goes on it gets worse, thus not enough with 20mg.

I can tell you I started out on 200mg about 5yrs ago. As my body has healed I am now on 75mg and continuing to go down yearly the more I bring my body back to normal.

It is certainly possible to have it effect your insulin levels which would be another reaon why you would want it followed by either an ND or a very knowledgeable MD.

Is anyone else having trouble posting long posts on WTM? I get to paragraph 3 and this thing starts bouncing around like crazy and it's driving me bananas!

patti

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Re: Progesterone Cream: How, Why & When to Use
« Reply #130 on: February 10, 2010, 09:59:47 AM » by boysmama

Katie,
It does sound like you may need more.
It may be that in order to make the best use of progesterone supplementation you also have to support other areas of the endocrine system, especially the adrenals.
I highly recommend reading everything you can find by Dr. Bruce Rind.

These two should get you started. I'd recommend reading the links in this order as the first is a basic overview, very helpful, but the second is specific to the progesterone issue.

http://www.drrind.com/therapies/metabolic-therapy

http://www.drrind.com/therapies/estrogen-dominance

Some where he also had an article explaining how progesterone supplementation without adrenal support can further stress the adrenals and, in fact, make the situation worse. I'm sorry I can't find it right now.

Also, I can't recommend temperature charting enough. Temps are an amazing window into the endocrine system. Basal body temps on waking will let you know if you are ovulating and where in your cycle. Charting as Dr. Rind describes-- http://www.drrind.com/therapies/metabolic-temperature-graph--will let you know which area adrenal or thyroid is the weakest and which needs to be supported first to bring the entire system back up to normal function. Fascinating stuff.

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Re: Progesterone Cream: How, Why & When to Use
« Reply #131 on: February 10, 2010, 10:31:31 AM » by mykidsmom

Can't agree with boysmama enough! I failed to mention that while I was on the progeesterone I was also on Armour thyroid, Isocort, and symplex F to nourish my entire glandular system. Definately, if other glands are suffering the body starts stealing from the entire system trying its best to balance all of them and it's a terrible circle. You may not need the supplementation for thyroid and adrenal I did, but it's definately important to find out where else you're insufficient because that part doesn't fix itself. It takes an overall approach to get the endocrine system fully functioning. But I can say, five years later, it can be done and it can be done naturally.

patti

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Re: Progesterone Cream: How, Why & When to Use
« Reply #132 on: February 19, 2010, 10:21:06 AM » by Kati*did

Thank you so much Patti and Boysmama -- and sorry it's taken me so long to reply!

I am going to check out the links you added, Boysmama. About 6 months ago, I started taking supplements to help with my adrenals (Dr. Christopher's adrenal blend along with some rhodiola and magnesium). Then, about 3 months ago, I started taking Beeyoutiful's Thyro-Vival to help the thyroid, too.

I went to my doc the other day and just asked her about the progesterone (she's not a natural doc, but is interested and has lots of patients who use the bioidentical progesterone). She looked at the the amount of progesterone per "serving" and said, "this is all you're getting?". So she, like you, Patti, thought the amount was way to minuscule.

She suggested I try it for at least 3 cycles and I'm going to try doubling the amount.

Again, thank you, thank you, thank you for all your input! Let me know if you ladies think of anything more. (It might take me a while to get back and check because we're having massive computer troubles.)

Katie

I forgot to add -- I've read the book (I can't remember the name -- by Rachel Weschler or ....??) about monitoring basal body temps to check for ovulation, and I have a thermometer and chart...and just haven't started!!! I *know* it would be immensely helpful and need to get started on that. We've been in constant flux for almost a year, now, and I keep saying I'll start when we finally settle down.... Tongue

« Last Edit: February 19, 2010, 10:27:09 AM by Kati*did »
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Re: Progesterone Cream: How, Why & When to Use
« Reply #133 on: March 03, 2010, 02:57:30 PM » by seosinger

Ever since my 3rd dd was born, I have had very low pre-ovulation temps (97 and below), as well as low post ovulation temps (highest it usually goes is 98.1). My cycle lengths are still normal (30-32 days). I have been charting for 7 years so I know that this is not normal for my body. I miscarried at 5 weeks in October from what I now believe was a progesterone issue because my temps just didn't rise like they did on my other pregnancies. I am now pregnant again (5 weeks today) and my temp is just staying around 97.9 to 98.1. Yesterday, I finally talked my dr. into checking my serum progesterone but he hasn't gotten back to me yet. I felt like he thought I was overreacting. My question is, if I am already pregnant, can I still start progesterone cream and prevent a miscarriage at this point?

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Re: Progesterone Cream: How, Why & When to Use
« Reply #134 on: March 03, 2010, 03:40:28 PM » by beppyjo

My first thought when I read your post was that, according to my book 'Taking Charge of your Fertility' by Toni Weschler(?), consistent low temps are indicative of thyroid issues not progesterone issues. So maybe you would want to look into that?
I started progesterone cream about 7 wks into my pregnancy with my Drs approval, not to try and prevent miscarriage but to help with my extreme morning sickness. I think that preventing miscarriage is going to be a case by case thing. Are you having symptoms of a miscarriage or just concerned about it?

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Re: Progesterone Cream: How, Why & When to Use
« Reply #135 on: March 04, 2010, 03:45:14 PM » by seosinger

Quote from: beppyjo on March 03, 2010, 03:40:28 PM

I'm mostly concerned because of the lack of consistently rising temps. They are up and down and way different than my last three pregnancies. There isn't an upward trend and its very similar to what was going on before I miscarried my last one in Oct. I have that book as well, and already had my thyroid function tested extensively. Everything looks normal as far as thyroid is concerned. I was also reading in the book that progesterone is the heat producing hormone, so if you aren't having an appropriate temp rise then it might be progesterone. I did talk to my OB and he is having me get my blood drawn again this afternoon. He said my levels are all normal, so now we are just making sure they are increasing, since my temps are not.

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Re: Progesterone Cream: How, Why & When to Use
« Reply #136 on: March 08, 2010, 07:32:27 PM » by Kitty

Patti-

I'm so glad for your consistent chant here that you take it on days 15-28. It's sinking in. Grin

I bought Emerita's cream and was following the peri-menopausal directions, which have one using it on days 8-28. Duh. I'm not there YET. Tongue

So. Tomorrow is day 15 and I will resume. Roll Eyes

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Re: Progesterone Cream: How, Why & When to Use
« Reply #137 on: March 08, 2010, 08:04:10 PM » by mykidsmom

Quote from: Yooper on March 08, 2010, 07:32:27 PM

Patti-

I'm so glad for your consistent chant here that you take it on days 15-28. It's sinking in. Grin

I bought Emerita's cream and was following the peri-menopausal directions, which have one using it on days 8-28. Duh. I'm not there YET. Tongue

So. Tomorrow is day 15 and I will resume. Roll Eyes

Sometimes I feel like a broken record. Undecided

I'm so glad it was helpful this time!! Cheesy

I will answer chocolate2 gal on the other thread. Just haven't had time yet.

patti

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Re: Progesterone Cream: How, Why & When to Use
« Reply #138 on: March 14, 2010, 10:17:03 PM » by Kitty

Chocolate2 suggested this link on another related thread: http://www.progesteronetherapy.com/how-to-use-progesterone-cream.html

My ? is re: dosing. I use the Emerita and they measure in tsp. (1/4- 1/2 t. twice daily), and I see ml listed often. I understand that 1 tsp. ~ 5 ml?

I am awfully tired on 1/4 t., twice daily. Undecided

I read that can be a side effect of too much? This is my 2nd month of it, but month #1 was a lower dose (more like 1/8 t.), from days 8-28. Roll Eyes

That did make me seem to miss ovulating. I did ovulate this month, though, right on schedule. Cheesy

Any comments? Patti? Grin

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Re: Progesterone Cream: How, Why & When to Use
« Reply #139 on: March 15, 2010, 12:19:41 AM » by mykidsmom

Quote from: Kitty on March 14, 2010, 10:17:03 PM

I read that can be a side effect of too much? This is my 2nd month of it, but month #1 was a lower dose (more like 1/8 t.), from days 8-28. Roll Eyes

That did make me seem to miss ovulating. I did ovulate this month, though, right on schedule. Cheesy

Any comments? Patti? Grin

That was a GOOD web page! I think it's very thorough. I was always taught to start on day 14 of ones cycle so who knows? One thing mentioned is that for sure everyone has to adjust progesterone to their body's needs. So perhaps my body always needed it on day 14? Huh

As such, I think following those guidelines will not cause adverse issues nor do I think following the guideline I use will cause adverse affects.

I don't agree with the twice a day and I don't agree with you can put it anywhere. Why would you put cream where it's more difficult to absorb? Less will get absorb in those areas in spite of what the author says. Logically, that just doesn't make sense. I was always taught to use the inside of the wrist, elbow, and upper arm and behind the knees. Rotating those 8 spots. I do NOT think it's a good idea to put in on the brea*sts as some people suggest. I would not recommend putting it over a major hormone center in the body (like the cha chas) for reason of cancer potential. The only time I would recommend a hormone center is for it to be used over the ovaries as a method of birth control. And this method must be done daily to achieve birth control.

Okay - now that I've lectured Grin

, on to your question. Yes, 1 tsp = 5mL. I've never had progesterone make me tired - although I've heard others say that. If you are tired on it I would cut back to the 1/4 tsp. per day and only use it at night. I don't like the twice a day dosing anyway. See how you feel. If you have any symptoms that you shouldn't (PMS, heavier bleeding, etc) then you are likely not getting enough. When progesterone is right where it should be, you should have no PMS symptoms, no excessive soreness, no cramping, etc. So I would suggest going back to where you were last month and seeing how you do. If you're in the middle of your progesterone phase right now, just lower it now. You don't need to wait for another whole cycle to do that. Did you feel like the 1/4 tsp. daily was enough? See if using it only at night for a week makes a difference.

I am pretty "free" with my progesterone. When I hit almost 40 (couple months before) I noticed I started getting "witchy" for lack of a better word on day 12 or 13 of my cycle. So I moved my progesterone up a little to day 12 and have had no issues since. So I think you just really have to listen to your body and adjust accordingly.

And you know me, I'm no fan of OTC progesterone. Wink

Not sure this helped at all. Roll Eyes

patti

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Re: Progesterone Cream: How, Why & When to Use
« Reply #140 on: March 16, 2010, 04:29:37 PM » by beelover

I am a midwife and totally against progesterone cream. Simply because any time you give the body something it should be making itself then it will cause the body to stop making it. When we have a mom that is miscarrying we give her pit lyph whole it is a supplement that causes the pituitary to start making the progesterone. It also work for any women that needs more progesterone in her body. HTH

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Re: Progesterone Cream: How, Why & When to Use
« Reply #141 on: March 16, 2010, 05:41:30 PM » by mykidsmom

Quote from: beelover on March 16, 2010, 04:29:37 PM

While I would love to hear more about this stuff you use to help kick in progesterone production, I have to disagree on the idea that when you give the body something it needs, it stops producing it. I think this could be true if you give it too much of what it needs. But if you are supplementing exactly what it needs to put the body in mid-normal range, the body heals. I have slowly healed my body from needing progesterone cream starting at 200mg a day, now down to 75mg a day because I am producing more of my own. I have been supplementing for 5yrs. It took me 1.5 yrs to begin being able to lower my dose. As I've removed substances that were blocking my body's normal production and healed other health issues, my body has kicked in quite well on it's own.

My .02

patti

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